Weaver's Way Co-op - Beyond Green Blogh/t ezra klein
(Anybody expecting me to lay down an un-measured "not crap" or "crap" on this topic overestimates me. But let's read this article above - which looks it emanates from just the vantage point I needed to hear from - and hold forth, spew links, etc., in the comments thread. Or we can just pretend this post never happened.)
18 comments:
chris matthews just harkened back wispily to "those old days" - apparently these days existed - when "kids rooted for american cars like they rooted for baseball teams."
Around here, if I am given to understand correctly, they did.
I can hardly claim expertise, but I'm here with a regional perspective if anyone wants it.
AP
Did anyone catch the president of the UAW defending management this morning on NPR? What's up with that?
And your perspective is always welcome, AP.
here's my question, does UAW bother to counter the "unions are bankrupting the auto industry" line of argumentation? What is the counter?
If some right-winger says "UAW workers cost the Big 3, on average, $71 an hour, while Toyota pays non-unionized American workers $47 an hour" what's the 10-word response?
I ask honestly, as I don't know it. All I know is "fuck you, asshole," but I since that line of argumentation is fast running its course.
i "sense" that that line of ...
Two things. One is that since the Big 3 offloaded their pension obligations into the VEBAs, I'm not sure the $71/$47 figures are accurate anymore (and, since I'm into my cups, I'm counting on your claim that they were accurate to begin with).
(Also, it may interest you to know that if GM goes bankrupt before mid-Feb, a certain former UF GAU pres will be out about $600,000 of your American pension dollars.)
Item two is--no, the union does not do a good job of countering this argument. (And I am a UAW member, via the National Writers' Union. Haven't heard a damn thing about it).
What I would say, if someone asked me while I were still in this information-free state, is that it's clear that unionization itself is not the problem; even Toyota uses union workers in the California plant where my Corolla was made.
The shit I take about my car never-ending, by the way. Never from an actual autoworker--if the UAW website says it's union-made, that is good enough for them. (But oddly, at least as of the last time I was there, it is not enough for the UAW itself, which endorses the car but has a policy of not allowing me to park it in the lot at Solidarity House.) Others, on the other hand, are full of ideas about my car ownership. In fact, we had a presenter in our office just last week who made a point of telling us that they require their employees to drive "American-make cars," as though that is dispositive about their union-supportiveness.
If the Big 3 had a marketing strategy other than public shaming, they might get my business. In the meanwhile I'm sticking with the people whose engineering once saved my sixteen-year-old life. Particularly in contrast to the Big 3's rabid support of the regulation-free environment that led to one of my co-workers' deaths in a single-vehicle SUV rollover a couple of years ago, I'll take my Toyota any day.
It does surprise me to hear Lex skeptical about kids rooting for cars. Cars, as you may have surmised, are a very emotional topic in these parts.
AP
To AP's last point - there's a reason that the phrase "mom, Chevrolet, and apple pie" exists and folks talk about the American "love affair" with the automobile. It's also the same explanation for our fucked up development patterns and lackluster public transit.
get this distinction, AP: I'm not skeptical about anybody's romance for cars; rather, I'm obsessive about Chris Matthews' every utterance in the same nonsensical way that I hate the Eagles AND listen to them too much.
high praise for the first VEBA mention of the thread. what the mainstream press omits, naturally, are the years of bargaining concessions that've been peppering issues of Labor Notes like so many (proverbial) peppers.
myself? i'm PLENTY "romantic" about my (Toreador Red) Ford Focus, in a "now I can respond to Deb on her schedule," FLOMAX-y kind of (purely metaphorical) way.
Scuttlebutt is that the $71/hr figure is no longer accurate, and that some analysts say that as a result of the UAW's last contract, the cost per hour might actually be cheaper than Toyota.
cspan is currently broadcasting the senate hearings avec the BIG 3 ceos and the head of the UAW. it's fascinating (for me.)
'good to see some Democrats talking sense and acknowledging the shellac-ing autoworkers have taken.
i hope they re-run this later so i can catch it in full.
Bob Corker (R-TN) just asked UAW prez Ron Gettelfinger to rank the Big 3 in terms of viability. Ron's response?
1) Ford
2) Chrysler
3) GM
Now Bob's wondering if, shucks, labor costs are the reason for the Big Three's problems. He just brought up "card check" for seemingly no reason....(wait for it)...he's against it.
Why, Bob wonders, won't Ron and the UAW "make the changes [they] need to make" in order for the Big 3 to be competitive?
All this to say, this is mandatory viewing for at least some of us.
( Question: would the Big 3's filing for bankruptcy void all of their collective bargaining agreements?)
I don't know that bankruptcy would necessarily void their contracts, but it would allow them to restructure legacy costs like pensions and other retirement benefits. But I'm also assuming that the subsequent bankruptcy induced layoffs would have to be conducted per contractual rules.
House session airs at 1pm ET sur le CSPAN.
One late add: the $71/hr figure, whether precisely accurate or not, is not the cost of employing today's autoworker. It is the cost of all of the employment-related costs the company currently owes (including all retirement costs) divided by the hours worked. So again, the comparison to auto manufacturers in locations with national health insurance, better retirement pensions, etc. is not apples-to-applies.
AP
i'm not sure if "Apples to Applies" was intentional, but i love it either way.
"apples to applies" reminds me of the "pineapple-y/pork-y" line over at the prisonship.
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